stevedover1965

Having a bit of a lull at the moment, finding it difficult to be inspired to draw, currently waiting for my surgery date and news about a severe pre- op diet, my Mother is ill with cancer and even though the sky is blue and the sun is shining it all seems a bit lack-luster right now. If you are wondering why this is not reserved for the prayer topic, well that seemed a little hypocritical of me as I am a confirmed atheist, don't be fooled though because I was still brought up with all the dogma and occasionally I fall back to the Catholicism that raised me. Oops not bitter really just a little down right now, still I am sure this won't last and I can rise above it all...eventually!

Baldur

Keep your chin up Steve and each trial eventually does end, you do move on. It's hard to focus on one issue as you are getting battered from different directions.

This was the Winter from Hell for Baldur. I was battered between family drama following the death of my father and a health issue of my own.

Being a fellow recovering Catholic puts me in the position to understand your predicament. I firmly avoid the prayer thread, yet I do find myself praying at times.

stevedover1965

Perhaps us non religious types need a place to air our upsets, who knows...Thanks Baldur, I am sorry about all the nasty things that has happened to you, in fact this is a world of woe for everyone but it is still a wonderful world full of joy and colour despite life's problems. I can't help feel a trifle selfish by sharing those thoughts with everyone when so much else is happening to others, in the scheme of things my life is not so bad, it ain't great either but it has it's good moments and I am blessed with a daughter that makes it all worthwhile, even if she is a teenager (lol) sometimes it is good to share.

Dragon

It's always good to get things out Steve. Don't feel selfish about it. Sometimes just writing things down makes me feel better about things that seem to be crappy in my life, like somehow it makes them lessen and gives me the chance to reflect and get through them.

I think it would be nice to have a place for non-prayers to get things out there too. I also avoid the Prayer Request thread because I'm not someone who prays and I too feel hypocritical going there. I think it's a wonderful thing for the people who use it and get comfort from it, I'm just not one of those people.

Good luck with your upcoming surgery (and its pre-op diet too).

Hazer

Steve and Baldur, I've been sitting here wondering if you would accept a comment here from someone who you may consider to be squarely in the other camp. I want to sincerely apologize to both of you if I have come across as being religious, or "holier then thou" in any way. I am so sorry that you both have been wounded and disillusioned by Catholicism. I am several generations removed from the Catholic church and have not suffered as my grandparents did, but I have heard the stories. I guess that rather then turning me away from Christianity altogether, it opened the door for me to become a follower of Christ without the trappings of organized religion.
I am sorry to hear that you are both experiencing difficult times. That is something we do have in common as my husband has been dealing with Stage 4 cancer since last September. I know what it's like to watch someone you love suffer. It is never easy. I find it hard to watch life go on for others when our world has been turned upside down. Baldur my family has been estranged since my parents passed 10 years ago. This too is hard at a time like this when I really need my family for support. But such is the broken world we live in. Just know that you are both thought of often and very much appreciated by your friends on TD.

Brunnhilde

A message of support from a confirmed atheist for you Steve. I'm so sorry you are in the doldrums at the moment - TD seems to be a wonderfully supportive forum and I hope I speak for others in saying that you honour us by sharing your worries - take care: it helps to share feelings; keep us informed so we can offer more support (in whatever form that comes) as and when you need it. Even anonymous friends can help in difficult times. I'll be sending good vibes down to Dover from the north east.

Brunnhilde

... another confirmed atheist ... [nice to know I'm not alone on here]

Brunnhilde

And good vibes to Baldur too. You brighten our lives so much with your messages and I do hope that your winter from hell will abate a little now that spring is here.

Normal

So happy to hear from the atheists! I've been deeply religious myself since childhood, but rarely found myself in any church situation which fit. I did not get bent out of shape from my 13 yrs at a mixed-breed Protestant Sunday School, though I did wonder if my younger brother and I were there so my dad could read the Sunday paper in peace for an hour. Lost interest when they tried to sell me the Virgin birth. I could tell that our embarrassed teacher did not buy it either.

My starting point for church rejection is that we are NOT sinners. I believe we are all part of the Whatever It Is. Love the message of A Course in Miracles about the choice between love and fear and getting there by means of radical forgiveness. And the interpretation of forgiveness is eye-opening. I've journeyed through Zen, Existentialism, Wicca, Theosopy and New Thought. Don't think any are truly wrong. I am delighted we are protected in the US by the foresight of Jefferson & his ilk, so we can each be right or wrong, or seeking or not, each in our own way, with nobody having the right to "straighten us out!"

clorophilla

Thanks steve to open this trend and sorry to hear your several challenges. I hope it'll be better soon!

Here I am too, although I'm not uneasy to go through the prayer topic to. I think that althoug I have not a structurated faith, I could pray in my way, and I believe in a spiritual matter of universe, if this could have sense for you.

Baldur, I hope you'll be out of this hell winther soon!

Normal

PS ~ Apologies for wandering from your topic, Steve! I will keep you in my thoughts and my version of prayer simply sees the best possible outcome, without telling deity what that is. When I had my hip replacement, my Unity friends did a great job of this and I felt a palpable positivity in the OR. (They keep you somewhat awake so you and the Dr. can agree on WHICH hip gets the slicing and carpentry.) Then the anesthesia gets going. Admittedly it creeps me out if folks wish to pray for my soul so as to keep it from Hell - their problem, not mine. Otherwise, have at it! Don't think it can hurt. I know all your TD friends are pulling for you, whatever form that may take.

bluemoon

I am with clorophilla on this. I have no structured religious commitment yet I see the universe in a spiritual way. I abhor anything that preaches intolerance. I feel I can "pray" in my own way.
And I send you all my best wishes.

matthew

Ah c'mon guys... Y'all know that Christianity would be just fine, if it wasn't for all us dang Christians...
Then again, in a "perfect" world, I doubt any of us would be here...

Gotta go pray for Normal's soul... Ta~Ta

Normal

Thanks, Matthew! My soul got a huge guffaw out of that this morning!

Lizzi

Thank you, Normal, et al, for voicing so many of my own dear opinions so eloquently! I am not an atheist. I am in recovery from organized religion (BIG Religion). The principle of 'freedom of religion' can be upheld only by recognizing that 'freedom from religion' is also a basic right. At times, it seems that some people are using TD as an evangelism medium. I enjoy and support diversity. What place does evangelism have in that? Evangelism is all about homogenization. TD gives us the chance to express aspects of our spiritual selves, without the need for structured religion. I hope this doesn't sound like a rant.

Dragon

Not rant-like at all Lizzi. Like others I do believe in spirituality but not organized religion. I believe there's a higher power, a heaven and a hell, I just don't think we understand it enough to say "This is what it's right to believe and everyone else is wrong".
I guess if I had to pick a religion to belong to it would be Buddhism because it preaches tolerance of the beliefs of other and teaches that we can make the world better by making ourselves better. That by looking into ourselves and finding peace and enlightenment is the first step.

mdawrcn

This is truly a tasteless joke and I hope I can repeat it here without offending anyone. I really don't mean to.

"God postponed the Rapture because people are too fat." David Letterman

stevedover1965

I learned today that Deborah (debray) lost her Father this weekend, he has been ill for a while and Debs had been spending her time caring for him at home, I chat with Debs regularly online and my thought's are with her during this difficult time.

stevedover1965

mdawrcn: don't worry I am not offended, coincidentally I received the surgery date for my Gastric Bypass which is taking place on 29th June, before that I will have to endure a diet consisting almost entirely of milk and water. David Letterman is a funny guy! The only rapture I want is sung by Blondie, those poor dupes who shelled out there life savings and sold homes in preparation for this so called event on the say so of some misguided individual, they are the ones I feel sorry for. I am so glad (GLAD) religion is not part of my life anymore. God I could do with some fried chicken right now guffaw, back to the milk...slurp!

Dragon

Good luck with your surgery Steve, I hope all goes well with it. Hope the milk/water diet doesn't increase the Doldrums too much.